The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss Audiobook

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• 
  caesar963
  January 7th, 2023
  

  

  A simple twist of fate, & the lights could’ve really gone out. And we might have lost Aeschylus.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  Within
  January 7th, 2023
  

  @caesar963 Why what is western Civilization? The last time I checked the western alphabets are phoenician and their numbers are Arabic. also theater existed already in egypt since middle kingdom go check The ancient Egyptian theatre by simple click by google.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  caesar963
  January 7th, 2023
  

  Well, that’s a hostile reaction, for some reason. Why what is where you ask? You could research Mediterranean cultures & city states. The contributions of the Jews, the Greeks, & the Romans. The democratic tradition, trace its development. The rule of law, fundamental rights, liberalism, philosophy. Great ideas that all can share in, without having to feel threatened or insecure.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  caesar963
  January 7th, 2023
  

  Also, our numerals actually originated in the great culture of India. Fair play to those lads.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  Malachie520
  January 7th, 2023
  

  It isn’t wrong to want to revisit the influences that shaped Western Civilization and those that took credit for the ideas while denying agency to those who originally had them but revisiting doesn’t mean dismissing. We, in the ‘more enlightened’ present, may look back and see the injustice, but it does not change how civilization in the west molded the ‘civilized’ world in its image. Nothing ever exists in a vacuum and just as ‘we’ owe a knowledge-debt to the Middle Civilization when the West was destroying pagan ideas (like science and math) in the middle ages, the same could be said with the East now borrowing from the West to be successful. The Middle peoples are still learning how to play on a world stage, some more successful than others.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  caesar963
  January 8th, 2023
  

  We do learn best from each other. We also owe an enormous debt to the medieval era - the university, the hospital, the concept & doctrine of human rights, the spread of literacy, learning, philosophy, art, architecture, literature, the preservation of the classics which have come down to us, etc. etc.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  johndunbar
  January 9th, 2023
  

  

  Thank you

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  Within
  January 9th, 2023
  

  @caesar963 The only civilizations in world history that are fully original were only 2 The mesopotamians and the Chinese all others were built upon their established ideas and creations. the greek were not only borrowers but too late on the game and the romans were even more. Europeans got their numbers from the back then enlightened islamic civilization not from indians.the current numbers are Arabic the Indian numbers goes into different style with no corners at them. there is almost nothing western in what you called western civilization all of these things were already existing before, they were just adopted and then developed. If you gonna define what is western civilization I would say it’s from URUK to New York. not from Athens to New york.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  caesar963
  January 10th, 2023
  

  “The only civilizations in world history that are fully original” - A pivot away from your first - “Why what is western Civilization?” - So, what are you actually trying to say? The book concerns the Battle of Salamis, which saved a fledgling Greek, & Western Civilisation. I’m interested in the history, not mindless nationalist distortions of history.
  As I said, we learn best from each other.
  “borrowers” - everyone is a borrower! So this is moot.
  “too late on the game” - ???
  “enlightened islamic civilization” - If this is more mindless nationalism, please drop it.

  Yes, as I said, our numerals actually originated in the great culture of India. Fair play to those Indian lads. They played an intellectual blinder.
  In your first sentence, you were then concerned with “originality” - yes! The point precisely. India is the great culture which originated numerals. Why not celebrate India for its superlative achievements? If “originality” is a sincere value?

  The Indian numbers had stylistic variations even within India, so yet another moot point.

  As a European & as a citizen of the world, I celebrate the myriad, incredible achievements of Western civilisation, as mentioned, & what other civilisations have managed as well. All should celebrate, partake & grow from these. Aggressive jealousy is a destructive emotion.
  However, any nationalist distortion of history - whether it be Russian, Arabic or English - I utterly reject as lies & self-serving bunk.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss
• 
  ProfitPagan
  January 26th, 2023
  

  

  Dammit, caesar, stop making good points!

  It’s worth noting that the European concept of chivalry was a poor translation of practices encountered during the Crusades. Not only were Arabs practicing the “Talking Cure” in ancient times, but had also incorporated music into the process.
  The concept of zero, without which there would be no practical mathematics, was first developed in Mesopotamia. Today, Mesopotamia occupies modern Iraq. In the broader sense, the historical region included present-day Iraq and parts of present-day Iran, Kuwait, Syria and Turkey.
  While still on the topic of the Crusades, it demands mentioning that when the European Crusaders breached Jerusalem, they killed everyone inside the walls. It was said (and then immortalized in paintings) that the streets of Jerusalem ran with blood up to their horses’ ankles.
  Yet when Yusuf ibn Ayyub ibn Shadi (commonly known as Saladin) recaptured the city in 1187, he gave strict orders that no one but Templars should be killed. That order was carried out without documented exception. Eventually he settled on a plan that allowed all women (regardless of religion) to leave the city with only what they could carry. Again, the tapestry of history concedes that hundreds (or more) women left Jerusalem carrying their husbands on their backs, unmolested, out of Jerusalem.
  And, of course, you’re right about our numerals. we like to call them Arabic, but this is due more to cultural (and possibly deliberate) misunderstanding more than actual history.
  All of this is to say please, caesar, stop making solid arguments and say something into which I can sink my teeth. Although, I suppose no conversation, even the tangential, can exist without a healthy dose of common ground and disagreement.
  Great book about a long-forgotten, and foundational, historic event, btw, even though the Peloponnesian War ended rather poorly for the Athenians.

  The Battle of Salamis: The Naval Encounter that Saved Greece—and Western Civilization - Barry S. Strauss

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